Monday, November 19, 2007

Daily Digest November 19, 2007


The DAILY DIGEST: INFORMATION and OPINION from ST. JOHN'S to VICTORIA.

EDITORIALs

ST.JOHN'S TELEGRAM - Jolt of reality
http://www.thetelegram.com/index.cfm?sid=81259&sc=80

CHARLOTTETOWN GUARDIAN - Our first ministers need to meet View comments2
This prime minister has yet to hold a national meeting of first ministers, and it's about time he did.
http://www.theguardian.pe.ca/index.cfm?sid=81120&sc=103

        Family Day offers more than a day off print this article
        Islanders deserve a chance to rest, but emphasis on families wouldn't go amiss.
         http://www.theguardian.pe.ca/index.cfm?sid=81533&sc=103

CAPE BRETON POST - Some hopes high for inquiry
http://www.capebretonpost.com/index.cfm?sid=81208&sc=151

HALIFAX NEWS - Taser video troubling View comments
http://www.hfxnews.ca/index.cfm?sid=81478&sc=90

HALIFAX CHRONICLE HERALD - Trade wave of the future
http://thechronicleherald.ca/Editorial/985854.html

         Angels: tread lightly
         http://thechronicleherald.ca/Editorial/985656.html

AMHERST DAILY NEWS - Getting tough on the fraudsters
http://www.amherstdaily.com/index.cfm?sid=81414&sc=61

MONTREAL GAZETTE - Jail time should be real time
http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/news/editorial/story.html?id=b427c4ee-8496-4779-ad79-479be3398b0f

        Media outlets need libel protection
         http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/news/editorial/story.html?id=60c3ae58-72a8-4fcb-bb09-72478a829b81

OTTAWA CITIZEN - Praying for water
http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/editorials/story.html?id=a2fc29b1-a783-4e4b-9a9d-a32391b21cd1

TORONTO STAR - What is best role for CBC today?
http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/277230

         Ontario deserves an equal voice
         http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/277221

        A break at the border
         http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/277231

         Disturbing trend in poverty rates
         http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/277237

TORONTO SUN - Revealing health care's private parts
http://www.torontosun.com/Comment/Commentary/2007/11/19/4667319-sun.html

SUDBURY STAR - Homeland security crossing the line
http://www.thesudburystar.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=780893

         Media's voice gets a boost
         http://www.thesudburystar.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=782289

        Change is coming; McGuinty government must deal with new realities of Ontario's economy
         http://www.thesudburystar.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=782291&auth=Wallace%2c+James

WINNIPEG FREE PRESS - Caseloads no panacea
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/editorial/story/4079621p-4679416c.html

        Shame on pillory
         http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/editorial/story/4079622p-4679421c.html

SASKATOON STARPHOENIX - Russia's ban on observers ominous sign
http://www.canada.com/saskatoonstarphoenix/news/forum/story.html?id=ae1bedb5-c89c-4af1-9d00-76e7d46b7090

REGINA LEADER-POST - Fixing an Ailing System
http://www.canada.com/reginaleaderpost/news/viewpoints/story.html?id=6cafdd86-3c79-415a-bef6-281715e47ea6

GRANDE PRAIRIE DAILY HERALD TRIBUNE - What are the scenarios for Pakistan?
http://www.dailyheraldtribune.com/Editorial/355281.html

LETHBRIDGE HERALD - What to do with chronic drunk drivers?
http://www.lethbridgeherald.com/article_8848.php

         Encryption call lost in translation
         http://www.lethbridgeherald.com/article_8863.php

PRINCE GEORGE CITIZEN - Pull their heads from the sand
http://www.princegeorgecitizen.com/news/current/n.php

         Society failing to nurture scientists
         http://www.princegeorgecitizen.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=104717&Itemid=161


ISSUES

CANADIAN FORCES
Canadian troops push into Taliban heartland
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20071118.wafghanfighting1118/BNStory/Afghanistan/home

No guaranteed protection against IEDs: analyst
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20071119/afghan_ieds_071119/20071119?hub=TopStories

Army faced bureaucratic battle to get tank purchase approved
http://www.recorder.ca/cp/National/071118/n111856A.html

General rules out NATO-run prisons
http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/277302

Working for Canada risky but lucrative
http://www.canada.com/edmontonjournal/news/story.html?id=3a607a6e-7be0-43ff-b92f-677bc5907e5b

Secrecy Surrounds Afghan Contracts
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=e2c00af3-59ee-4e39-a139-719d8c59fa1f

Afghanistan wants more than sinks
http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cyberpresse.ca%2Farticle%2F20071119%2FCPSOLEIL%2F71118093%2F5019%2FCPSOLEIL&langpair=fr%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

Where death can strike at any time
http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cyberpresse.ca%2Farticle%2F20071118%2FCPACTUALITES%2F711180564%2F5846%2FCPACTUALITES&langpair=fr%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

Western countries don't treat detainees well either
http://thechronicleherald.ca/Opinion/985900.html

Guards 'killed Afghan civilians'
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/7102390.stm


CANUSA/USACAN
Day calls for border policy review
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20071119.wambulance1119/BNStory/National/home

Canadian producers welcome U.S. border reopening Monday to older cattle, meat
http://www.recorder.ca/cp/National/071118/n111848A.html


ECONOMIC AFFAIRS
Free trade would have helped lumber industry, economist says
http://www.princegeorgecitizen.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=104331&Itemid=596


FOREIGN AFFAIRS
Foreign minister raises eyebrows with absence from Pakistan talks
http://www.recorder.ca/cp/National/071118/n111886A.html


JUSTICE SYSTEM
Tasers necessary, Day says
http://www.thestar.com/News/article/277691

Save outrage for drunk drivers: Day
http://www.thestar.com/News/article/277692


MIGRATION
Compounding immigration mess
http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/277239


POLITICS IN THE PROVINCES
What should first ministers discuss? Start with global realities
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20071119.RAGENDAMAXWELL19/TPStory/TPBusiness/Politics/

Federalists finally find their voice
http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/277694

Federalists tell Quebecers to shed 'victim complex' in new book
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=2c726327-b202-4e3d-b66d-8c9ea3f0ae64

Alberta can be a global leader in alternative energy
http://www.canada.com/edmontonjournal/news/opinion/story.html?id=80b520f2-9db7-4869-964f-455c24b3ca30

Harper gains key ally for CWB reform
http://www.canada.com/saskatoonstarphoenix/news/forum/story.html?id=2b02c9f4-794f-4f3d-9a10-9ea48d94deab

Charest reiterates call for conference on loonie
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2007/11/19/4668644-cp.html


POLITICS
Tories under fire over detainee abuse
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20071119.wqp1119/BNStory/Afghanistan/home

PM denies coverup over Afghan abuse allegations
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2007/11/19/afghan-harper.html

Despite Mulroney controversy, Tories' support steady: poll
http://www.squareonelive.com/index.php?topic=501.0

Libs, NDP, and Bloc should open up election ad financing books too, say Conservatives
http://www.thehilltimes.ca/html/cover_index.php?display=story&full_path=/2007/november/19/legislation/&c=1

Mulroney, Schreiber inquiry to give Tories a 'cause for pause' on early election
Some say Tories want to delay public inquiry.
http://www.thehilltimes.ca/html/cover_index.php?display=story&full_path=/2007/november/19/inquiry/&c=1

Brent Barr was turfed as the candidate for the federal Conservatives a couple weeks ago. Now he's contemplating dropping his support for the party. But how did it get to here? http://news.guelphmercury.com/News/Front/article/262234

                         L'affaire Schreiber
                  all 133 news articles »


Mulroney-era ethics code could be used to judge ex-PM
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=e4203093-ed5e-4882-afb6-cbef4a341460&k=74453

Schreiber case folds all bets on national politics
http://thechronicleherald.ca/Opinion/985792.html

Mulroney-Schreiber affair: the questions
http://www.canada.com/topics/news/politics/story.html?id=cb13d078-c11a-4fd3-b4a8-8300bf26db76

RCMP knew of alleged payment
But Mulroney deal couldn't be confirmed, so probe dropped
http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/story.html?id=a7194c3d-743c-4027-a1f8-42176bcec2f7&k=75668

Mulroney-Schreiber investigation puts Harper in conflict of interest
Fully impartial inquiries needed to clean up ethical questions about federal government activities
http://www.harperindex.ca/ViewArticle.cfm?Ref=00115

You Decide - Did Mulroney Lie Under Oath?
http://the-mound-of-sound.blogspot.com/2007/11/you-decide-did-mulroney-lie-under-oath.html

OK, so that was dumb
http://www.edmontonsun.com/Comment/2007/11/18/4665411-sun.html

Dion wants Harper's office included in inquiry
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20071118/dion_inquiry_071118/20071118?hub=Canada

Opposition wants Schreiber extradition cancelled
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20071116/schreiber_mulroney_071116?s_name=&no_ads =

No apology from Liberal MP sued by Mulroney
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20071115/mulroney_thibault_071115?s_name=&no_ads =

Key figure in Mulroney probe threatens silence
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20071116/wl_canada_nm/canada_scandal_schreiber_col;_ylt=AmGF8zQi.d.hURx1as25uqmjbA8F

CTV's Question Period: Bob Rae, Liberal foreign affairs critic, and Tom Flanagan, Fmr. Conservative campaign manager 8:36
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/HTMLTemplate?tf=/ctv/mar/video/new_player.html&cf=ctv/mar/ctv.cfg&hub=Canada&video_link_high=mms://ctvbroadcast.ctv.ca/video/2007/11/18/ctvvideologger2_500kbps_2007_11_18_1195404455.wmv&video_link_low=mms://ctvbroadcast.ctv.ca/video/2007/11/18/ctvvideologger2_218kbps_2007_11_18_1195402344.wmv&clip_start=00:01:48.07&clip_end=00:08:36.45&clip_caption=CTV's%20Question%20Period:%20Bob%20Rae,%20Liberal%20foreign%20affairs%20critic,%20and%20Tom%20Flanagan,%20Fmr.%20Conservative%20campaign%20manager&clip_id=ctvnews.20071118.00222000-00222747-clip1&subhub=video&no_ads=&sortdate=20071118&slug=dion_inquiry_071118&archive=CTVNews

CTV's Question Period: MPs on the Mulroney inquiry 9:37
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/HTMLTemplate?tf=/ctv/mar/video/new_player.html&cf=ctv/mar/ctv.cfg&hub=Canada&video_link_high=mms://ctvbroadcast.ctv.ca/video/2007/11/18/ctvvideologger3_195402092_1195402993_500kbps.wmv&video_link_low=mms://ctvbroadcast.ctv.ca/video/2007/11/18/ctvvideologger3_195402091_1195401552_218kbps.wmv&clip_start=00:13:07.88&clip_end=00:09:37.21&clip_caption=CTV's%20Question%20Period:%20MPs%20on%20the%20Mulroney%20inquiry&clip_id=ctvnews.20071118.00222000-00222744-clip2&subhub=video&no_ads=&sortdate=20071118&slug=dion_inquiry_071118&archive=CTVNews

CTV's Question Period: Bob Rae, Liberal foreign affairs critic, and Tom Flanagan, Fmr. Conservative campaign manager 8:36
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/HTMLTemplate?tf=/ctv/mar/video/new_player.html&cf=ctv/mar/ctv.cfg&hub=Canada&video_link_high=mms://ctvbroadcast.ctv.ca/video/2007/11/18/ctvvideologger2_500kbps_2007_11_18_1195404455.wmv&video_link_low=mms://ctvbroadcast.ctv.ca/video/2007/11/18/ctvvideologger2_218kbps_2007_11_18_1195402344.wmv&clip_start=00:01:48.07&clip_end=00:08:36.45&clip_caption=CTV's%20Question%20Period:%20Bob%20Rae,%20Liberal%20foreign%20affairs%20critic,%20and%20Tom%20Flanagan,%20Fmr.%20Conservative%20campaign%20manager&clip_id=ctvnews.20071118.00222000-00222747-clip1&subhub=video&no_ads=&sortdate=20071118&slug=dion_inquiry_071118&archive=CTVNews

Mike Duffy Live: A discussion of the legal options if Schreiber is extradited
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/HTMLTemplate?tf=/ctv/mar/video/new_player.html&cf=ctv/mar/ctv.cfg&hub=Canada&video_link_high=mms://ctvbroadcast.ctv.ca/video/2007/11/16/ctvvideologger3_195212599_1195250830_500kbps.wmv&video_link_low=mms://ctvbroadcast.ctv.ca/video/2007/11/16/ctvvideologger3_195212598_1195249391_218kbps.wmv&clip_start=00:03:10.15&clip_end=00:14:55.89&clip_caption=Mike%20Duffy%20Live:%20A%20discussion%20of%20the%20legal%20options%20if%20Schreiber%20is%20extradited&clip_id=ctvnews.20071116.00222000-00222580-clip1&subhub=video&no_ads=&sortdate=20060919&slug=duffy_promo_060919&archive=CTVNews

Harper-Mulroney chill a test for Tories
http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/277693

Liberals want probe expanded
http://www.thestar.com/News/article/277695

Keep focus of Mulroney inquiry narrow, Rae says
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20071119.wschreiber19/BNStory/National/home

Mulroney misled us on Schreiber: Chrétien
Liberals believed claims about Schreiber
http://www.canada.com/victoriatimescolonist/news/story.html?id=5cf85b6d-f174-4dd3-8a8f-5652a784bf0f

Is tender system corruptible?
New probe could go well beyond Mulroney
http://www.canada.com/edmontonjournal/news/opinion/story.html?id=d8f54781-a295-46c8-9bf5-75478edbebe6

Who's running this country: Harper or Schreiber?
German businessman is attempting to blackmail PM into letting him stay
http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/news/editorial/story.html?id=d0269906-076c-46ab-88e5-b05fbd836ae9

Re: Letters To The PM Don't Go Missing, Don Martin, Nov. 15.
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/editorialsletters/story.html?id=277a72aa-c853-4414-b44b-2c4e7223a5f0


PROGRAMMES
Tories tackle identity theft, youth crime with new legislation
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20071119.wtorycrime1119/BNStory/National/home

Government proposes tougher sentences for violent youth
http://www.politicswatch.com/index2.html#morningbrief

Bill C-22 cheats Ontario, but MPs stay quiet
http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/277658

Tories make new bid to kill gun registry
http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/277330


PRESSURE POINTS
Final global warming report highlights risks to Canada, world; urges action
http://www.recorder.ca/cp/National/071117/n111732A.html

An unstoppable problem
Global warming is very real, but there's nothing humankind can do about it.
http://www.hfxnews.ca/index.cfm?sid=81509&sc=93

An 8,000-year-old take on Noah's Ark
http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=36b1c0ae-a1b9-47bb-a5ff-2e0f00e474a5

What we're doing to the air we breathe
1. Pollution hits children first
http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/editorial/story.html?id=bc53a869-2d5f-4ac3-90d2-73ccf5ec2066

Peeking into the ocean's plumbing
On a recent expedition aboard an icebreaker, scientists check the vital signs of the Arctic Ocean, trying to fathom how its chemistry and circulation is being stirred up by climate change http://www.canada.com/edmontonjournal/news/story.html?id=63a3e149-472d-48c0-a215-5036423ea4af

A history of a warm Arctic
http://www.thestar.com/ArcticInPeril/article/277298

Atkinson Series: Arctic in Peril
[]
Audio slideshow (medium bandwith)
[]
Audio slideshow (high bandwidth)
[]
Map: Key locations in the series (PDF)
[]
Map: Who owns the Arctic? (PDF)
[]
Map: How Arctic 'plumbing' went awry (PDF)


OPINION AND INFORMATION
Children's rights: From rhetoric to reality
http://www.canada.com/reginaleaderpost/news/viewpoints/story.html?id=c8000367-55a6-4994-b4c9-86321d6c9a9c

Lobbyists the real power brokers
http://thechronicleherald.ca/Opinion/985579.html

The front men
http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/opinion/story.html?id=6567e4b5-d20f-4bce-9445-c0600920b046

Jihadists aren't in Afghanistan (or Iraq) because 'we' are
http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/editorial/story.html?id=b2d5c2a7-b7fd-409f-bb33-ce59bb05461d

Era of cheap oil is about to end
http://www.canada.com/calgaryherald/news/theeditorialpage/story.html?id=94f423bd-4d3a-4b4c-ae95-4fbe5ec4706d

Seniors beware: those discounts are in jeopardy
http://www.canada.com/calgaryherald/news/story.html?id=b252331a-a646-444e-a46e-47fb346ea82f

Legislation unfairly targets hunters' firearms
http://www.canada.com/windsorstar/news/editorial/story.html?id=50cf6cbe-d61b-4f86-95cc-70b354f7b25c


INFOS

Jeunes contrevenants
Ottawa vise la coercition
http://www.radio-canada.ca/nouvelles/Politique/2007/11/19/001-lois-criminalite.shtml

Affaire Airbus
Une erreur de junior, estime Chrétien
http://www.radio-canada.ca/nouvelles/Politique/2007/11/19/002-chretien-entrevue.shtml

Dollar canadien: Jean Charest redemande une réunion des premiers ministres
http://info.branchez-vous.com/Nationales/071119/N1119131AU.html

Stockwell Day demande aux Américains de revoir leur politique frontalière
http://info.branchez-vous.com/Nationales/071119/N1119113AU.html

L'absence du ministre Bernier fait sourciller
http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20071118/CPACTUALITES/71118096/1025/CPACTUALITES

Le gouvernement Harper s'attaque à la criminalité
http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20071118/CPACTUALITES/71118073/1025/CPACTUALITES

L'Afghanistan veut plus que des puits
http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20071119/CPSOLEIL/71118093/5019/CPSOLEIL

Là où la mort peut frapper à tout moment
http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20071118/CPACTUALITES/711180564/5846/CPACTUALITES

Affaire Mulroney-Schreiber - Chrétien aurait préféré une enquête policière
http://www.ledevoir.com/2007/11/19/164975.html

Affaire Mulroney-Schreiber - Stéphane Dion veut une enquête élargie
http://www.ledevoir.com/2007/11/19/164956.html

L'achat de chars de combat pour l'armée canadienne a fait l'objet d'intenses débats
http://www.ledevoir.com/2007/11/19/164933.html


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________________________________________________________
Subject: I expect this will be the topic of conversation in the DD, no?
From: "Jason Hickman"
At 05:47 PM 17/11/2007

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20071117.tories17/BNStory/National/home

Are you going with them?

- Jason H.

=====
That there are those who were members of the Progressive Conservative Party of Canada who have been drawn to working within the Liberal Party in opposition to Stephen Harper's Conservative Party of Canada is nothing new. 

David Orchard, those following his lead, and others chose to do so last year.  They played a role in electing Stephane Dion Leader of the Party of Canada. It may be Stephane will be able to alter the pattern of his Party from following its categorical imperative, that of power at any cost, which has been the hallmark of its actions.

Dion and those supporting him must be wished well in achieving this for the good of our country.  That they will succeed is not at all certain.

What is certain is that the Gloria Galloway's article is accurate provided those who held the positions necessary for recognition by Elections Canada be considered the "entire executive". En masse they resigned from the PC Party and since then have chosen to become Liberals.  We are all at liberty to choose the direction we will follow.

To answer Jason's question, I did not but rather called together those "senior members of the party" believing in a continuing purpose being served by having a progressive-conservative party in the arena of Canada wide politics. Meetings were held and the vacated positions of Leader, President, Secretary, Treasurer and Chair of the Macdonald-Cartier Fund filled on an interim basis to meet the  requirements of Elections Canada.

Contact with Elections Canada was made ensuring a smooth transmission. Those Gloria Galloway terms "Key members" have been replaced.  There is renewed and energetic commitment to offering a positive option to Canadians.

The Liberal-Conservative  Party, founded 1854, is continuing as the Progressive Canadian Party, as the progressive-conservative alternative to the extremes of the left and right of Layton and Harper, the as yet unaltered opportunism of the Liberal Party, and of other parties perceived as being based on single issues.

Canadians have now and will have the alternative available to them of choosing the approach to governing of progressive-conservatives, that of "progress with care".

Jason wrote "I expect this will be the topic of conversation in the DD, no?"

As always whether it becomes a "topic of conversation" is in your hands.

The text of the article announcing the joining and COMMENTs made to the Globe and Mail follow.

         Joe Hueglin
         905-356-3901

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POLITICS: RENEGADES ONCE MORE
Key members of Progressive Canadians to join federal Liberals

GLORIA GALLOWAY
November 17, 2007

OTTAWA -- The entire executive and many senior members of the small political party formed by Progressive Conservatives who rejected the merger with the Canadian Alliance have decided to join the Liberals.

The Progressive Canadian Party, which expropriated the PC logo and adhered to the ideals of the old Tory party, will likely continue, said Tracy Parsons, who quit as party leader two weeks ago.

But Ms. Parsons will be taking out a Liberal membership, as will party president Jim Love, the four other members of the executive, several members of the national council, all of the CPC's Quebec organizers and many riding presidents.

The executive made the decision to quit en masse. It was a surprise when the others followed.

There was a realization, said Ms. Parsons, that Liberal Leader Stéphane Dion was offering policy options that closely mirrored their own.

"As a political party you are always trying to find your differentiators [with other parties] and I found that when Stéphane Dion became the leader of the Liberal Party that that differentiator was harder and harder to locate," explained Ms. Parsons, who lives in Truro, N.S., and had been party leader since 2005.

"He had a lot of the same visions for the country that we had. And, of course, the Liberal Party has sort of moved into that Progressive Conservative space anyway."

There were also some key points of departure with other Progressive Canadian Party members, she said.

"So when you start having some fundamental disagreements on direction inside the party, you have to start asking yourself where your energies are best spent. And if I am going to put out that much energy I would like to do good for this country," Ms. Parsons said.

The Progressive Canadians are not large in number. They fielded just 25 candidates in the last federal election and took 0.1 per cent of the popular vote.

But the move will be seen as a shot in the arm for Mr. Dion, who has been derided by the Conservatives as a weak leader and who, according to a recent survey, is not as widely recognized by Canadians as Mario from Nintendo's video-game series.

Ms. Parsons said neither she nor any of the other defectors have ever been Liberal.

Her own association with the old Progressive Conservatives goes back two decades. "I was active in riding associations, president's council and I worked as a field organizer when [Jean] Charest was the leader," she said.

"Ten years ago I would have said of course I was crossing to the enemy. But, if you look at being a Progressive Conservative towards the end of that party, those lines were becoming incredibly blurred under [former prime ministers] Jean Chrétien and Paul Martin."

Not surprisingly, Ms. Parsons said she found the federal Liberals "very welcoming. I am sure they were surprised."

Senator Marie Poulin, the president of the federal Liberal Party, said the Liberals take the new arrivals as evidence of their leader's broad appeal to Canadians of many political backgrounds.
===================================
Members say Dion offers policy options that closely mirror their own
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20071117.tories17/CommentStory/National/home

This conversation is closed

   1.
      J.C. Davies from Canada writes:
      'Senator Marie Poulin, the president of the federal Liberal Party, said the Liberals take the new arrivals as evidence of their leader's broad appeal to Canadians of many political backgrounds.'

      Yet again a Liberal press release presented as a news story.

          * Posted 17/11/07 at 10:29 AM EST | Link to Comment
   2.
      Joseph Freeman from Vancouver, Canada writes: Before the hounds arrive with their name calling and derision, I just want to say it's nice to see that some people actually still think about policy and what kind of national priorities they desire.

      Kudos to the Progressive Canadians for looking beyond the hype and political labelling and seeing qualities they like in Dion.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 10:43 AM EST | Link to Comment
   3.
      Gravol Insomnia from Canada writes: Comparing any politician to Super Mario, is an insult to Super Mario.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 10:47 AM EST | Link to Comment
   4.
      Ed Doerksen from Simcoe, Canada writes: Everyone knew this would happen. The old Progressive Conservative Party was nothing more than a different fold in the same liberal cloth. Red Tories are nothing more than liberals.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 10:52 AM EST | Link to Comment
   5.
      Vote NDP in the next federal/provincial election. from Toronto, Canada writes: I guess the Conservative party can't tolerate any differences in opinion. We have seen this with the Progressive Canadian party. This is why the Conservative party can't maintain its own members when they're losing them to the equivalent Liberal party such as Garth Turner, Scoot Brison, Belinda Stronach and more.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 10:53 AM EST | Link to Comment
   6.
      K. W. from Montreal, Canada writes: Kind of a misleading article don't you think? From the strangely propagandistic headline, to 'mistakes' like including CPC as the acronym for the party within the body text...uh shouldn't that be PCP?

      References to 'all of the CPC's Quebec organizers and many riding presidents' are both factually (CPC) and more figuratively misleading...I wonder how many people this group is comprised of? For a party that fielded 25 candidates (and not all in Quebec) how many organizers are there in Quebec?

      If only 'many' riding presidents are becoming Liberals, what does this translate to? A dozen or so people?

      When you read the article, it becomes apparent that there is a significant number of people in the 'party' that aren't leaving at all...sounds like a bun-fight amongst a small fringe party at best.

      Come on Globe and Mail, the bias these days seems clear, but when stories actually just seem like trumped-up propaganda pieces one crosses a bit of a line, no?
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 10:54 AM EST | Link to Comment
   7.
      PJ Robertson from Canada writes: In politics as in life, there are progressives and regressives. Progressives envision and anticipate; regressives deny and disinform. Progressives include; regressives exclude. Progressives have open minds; regressives have closed minds. Progressives embrace the future, regressives stick to the past. Progressives animate; regressives intimidate.

      Two key questions: 1) Are Canadians essentially progessive or regressive? 2) Is Canada's current government essentially progressive or regressive? Canada's future hangs on how Canadians choose to answer.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 10:54 AM EST | Link to Comment
   8.
      Fandango Fandango from Canada writes: It's either Harper's way or the highway...the ones with principles and ethics take the highway. I applaud this group for their move which is based on values. I expect we will see more crossings as the fractures expand between Harper's Reform party and the old PC members. Their marriage has only been held together by bulling and threats.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:08 AM EST | Link to Comment
   9.
      wddfwf dsffgeg from Toronto, Canada writes: Perhaps Ms. Parsons and her group are not old enough to see that Lieberals are neither right-wing, left-wing, progressive nor anything else. They simply stake out whatever turf they think will get them elected from time to time. Sure they look like PCs today because most sensible people are appalled at the hateful, small-minded, mean-spirited Conservative social agenda, yet understand that we are still hugely overtaxed and fiscally mismanaged.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:16 AM EST | Link to Comment
  10.
      Aaron C from TO, Canada writes: 'Red Tories are nothing more than liberals.'
      Red Toryism as an ideology is pretty distinct from liberalism. Maybe these particular Red Tories were liberals.

      As for the rest, nobody really misses Turner, Brison, or Stronach, and a few liberals have crossed to floor to the conservatives as well.

      This article suffers from the same problem as another G&M article I read recently: it says something, but doesn't give any reasons for it. I would be interested to know what policies of Dion's the 'PCs' prefer.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:24 AM EST | Link to Comment
  11.
      Hortence Washington from Canada writes: 'It's not fair' DION and his LIEBERALS attract only loooooooooosers.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:31 AM EST | Link to Comment
  12.
      P. Hiebert from Canada writes: I did not even know this party still existed. I am sure that Canadians are going to pay attention and follow the lead of a party that fielded 25 candidates and garnered .1% of the vote.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:31 AM EST | Link to Comment
  13.
      are we ruled by war criminals ? Bill C-22 is undemocratic from Canada writes: Vote NDP in the next federal/provincial election. from Toronto, Canada writes.............................Posted 17/11/07 at 10:53 AM EST

      They did not join the ndp ? Will the ndp support C-22 to increase their B.C. caucus ?
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:31 AM EST | Link to Comment
  14.
      bruno tomassini from Canada writes: I think it shows two things:

      1- Dion is slowly emerging as a strong LEADER because of his policies.

      2- The union of Alliance and ex PC people in Ottawa in cracking as they are not united on policies.

      cheers!

      Disclaimer: I'm not affiliated with any political party.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:36 AM EST | Link to Comment
  15.
      Craig Cooper from Toronto, writes: I wonder what the bribe was. I'm sure we'll see soon enough.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:40 AM EST | Link to Comment
  16.
      Gail Thomas from Canada writes: Good for them. They're only following what suits their political ideals. One thing you can say about politics, it's a very dividing sport, especially with continual Liberal posturing. It always comes down to the voters anyway and who they think will do the best job of protecting Canada's citizens, improving the economy, and in general telling it like it is even though the media for the most part is on the side of the left. I just hope they stay happy and don't regret their move to a party whose leader is so far down in the public polls it's a wonder he doesn't step down to make room for someone with better leadership skills. This ex-professor doesn't get a passing grade from me.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:42 AM EST | Link to Comment
  17.
      Globe Insider subscriber content
      Andre Carrel from Salmo, Canada writes: This is really a story about the consequences of Canada's rather undemocratic first-past-the-post electoral system which results in the multiple views of the majority being dismissed in favour of the singular view of the largest minority. Whatever party or ideology that might be from time to time.

      A system of proportional representation would have a few members of the Progressive Canadians, and a few members of the Green Party, in our Parliament to represent the diversity of political views held by Canadians instead of having one view foisted on the majority under the 'threat' of yet another election to anoint yet another plurality to impose its will on the majority.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:49 AM EST | Link to Comment
  18.
      Yvonne Wackernagel from Woodville, Canada writes: I am sure Mr. Dion, A MAN OF IJTEGRITY, will welcome the help to show Canadians that good economic policies, social and otherwise, is the way to go for benefit. We are tired of Harper's negative ads, low class, as he is!

      Now, we should encourage some of the others, Sinclair Stevens, Joe Clark, Flora McDonald, etc. etc. to slip over also. And, just maybe, Belinda will stay to help out as SHE WAS THE ONE TO USE HER MONEY to put Harper (accidentally) into this position -UNFORTUNATELY.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:51 AM EST | Link to Comment
  19.
      bill johnson from Quebec, Canada writes: Wow. First the defense of Taliban executioner prisoners, then the formal support for terrorist groups including the Tamil Tigers and radical Sikhs, and now the Progressive Canadians.

      Dion is building a very wide tent indeed. Bravo.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:51 AM EST | Link to Comment
  20.
      Bill Fraser from toronto, Canada writes: This would be a big story if anybody had heard of the Progressive Canadian Party. I'm sure the Conservatives, Liberals, Bloc or NDP have as many new members join every few hours.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:04 PM EST | Link to Comment
  21.
      Globe Insider subscriber content
      S. Ives from Ottawa, Canada writes: I would recognize Mario before I would recognize Mr Harper.

      I don't see this as a slap at Mr Harper, Mr Dion, Mr Layton, Hillary Clinton, G. W. Bush, or Prince Charles. The only more recognizable living person is Her Majesty the Queen.

      And I am quite satisfied with that arrangement.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:11 PM EST | Link to Comment
  22.
      Roslyn Ritz from Montreal, Canada writes: It would appear that anyone that can will desert the Cons. Now they are not even talking to Brian Mulroney who was a great asset and gave good advise to Harper. Harper's party has no sense of allegiance to anybody. They ditch the two and a half million (mainly seniors) people who bought income trusts on Harper's promise. Brian Mulroney should not be surprised if they ditch him. The Canadian man who is going to be executed in Montana must be thinking 'why did they change the laws in existence for years and years so that I will be executed' Sorry sir, get in line, the Cons lie to everyone
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:15 PM EST | Link to Comment
  23.
      Zando Lee from Vancouver, Canada writes: ...yep, time to bury the hatchet....hopefully not in each other's back....
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:35 PM EST | Link to Comment
  24.
      Jesse Winger from Cardston, Canada writes: The Conservatives are not progressive or tolerant of their members views.. that goes without saying. Our Great Leader PM Harper has clearly shown that.

      Good move, I guess, for the old school PC's!
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:18 PM EST | Link to Comment
  25.
      Donalda Williams Clogg from Hudson, Canada writes: This is really good news. The Liberals are a forward looking party. This bodes well for the future. Integrity and standing up for ones principles are so important, as Mr.Dion has shown.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:19 PM EST | Link to Comment
  26.
      Egg Plant from The West, Canada writes: Yawn.....Good!! Next story, please.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:37 PM EST | Link to Comment
  27.
      J L from Thunder Bay, Canada writes: What a surprise what took them so long,for goodness sakes?These are the tailings of the former Proggressive conservate party thankfully no longer in exsistance at the federal level.These people were never conservative,they were Liberals!alway were.but just didn't want to admit it.The bob stanfields,the Joe Clarks. and all those who called themselves conservatives but governed like Liberals (mr Mulruney?).Most of the proggressives have already returned to their political roots by joining the Liberal Party and should have done so years ago when the conservative Party of Canada became truly Conservative in philosopy,both fiscally and socially.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:37 PM EST | Link to Comment
  28.
      Vern McPherson from writes: Which means whatever was left of the swing vote the COns captured last time is gone. Now they are down to the hard core misfits.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:40 PM EST | Link to Comment
  29.
      tl best from the end of the world, Canada writes: This is funny...the globe keeps blocking any attempt to question the validity of the story and yet post after post of left wing anti PC garbage gets posted.......nice job G&M......
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:49 PM EST | Link to Comment
  30.
      Zando Lee from Vancouver, Canada writes: ...old Stevie has really taken the 'progressive' away from the Conservative...gone are the days of the trusted Stanfield and Clark, the latter being the last principled Conservative leader, before he was assassinated by being stabbed to his political death by the convention delegates wielding their pointed Martini swizzle sticks, thereby ensuring the ascension of the giant Chin to power ....we now find out that this was a paid assassination...sponsored by one Karlheinz Schreiber who came to Canada with 20 million in God we trust dollars and instructions to do whatever it takes to sell some Airbuses...the rest as we say, is history....
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:53 PM EST | Link to Comment
  31.
      Jimmy Hendrikx from Varna, Canada writes: the CPC is a group of people who strongly opposed the New PC party merger. I am still on their mailing list. They originally thought that their was enough support that they would provide an alternative to the New PC party. Funny thing is that their numbers dwindled and they continued to lose embarrassingly. The executive just wanted out, and i am sure that the PC party wouldn't take them. Harper had nothing to do with forcing them out.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:56 PM EST | Link to Comment
  32.
      Conehead O'Briiiiian from Cape Cod Liver oil,, Canada writes:

      Brina Mulroney's party moving over to the Liberals.

      Birds of a feather.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:56 PM EST | Link to Comment
  33.
      Derek Holtom from Swan River, Canada writes: what are we talking about here - a few dozen? a couple hundred at most? out of millions? a little perspective is needed here I think
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 12:57 PM EST | Link to Comment
  34.
      Vern McPherson from writes: Zando Lee from Vancouver,

      ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      Sure the COns support is drying up. Look at the silly issues they seem fixated on. Certain;ly not ones at the top of Canadians's to do list. And the reason Canadians do not trust the CPC becomes more and more obvious as each day passes. How can there be an inquiry for example if the main character is not here ???
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 1:03 PM EST | Link to Comment
  35.
      John Silverman from Canada writes: This mirrors what's happening everywhere - those who even remotely on the fringe are abandoning the conservatives and joining the Liberals. Not unexpected.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 1:24 PM EST | Link to Comment
  36.
      D F from Canada writes: I am going to join federal liberal party
      Lets everybudy join them
      quit that pro american conservative and join Canadain party
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 1:34 PM EST | Link to Comment
  37.
      citizen's arrest canadian duty from Canada writes: good, at least they are no longer duping innocent citizens into believing they are conservative when in fact they aren't and never were. wolves in sheeps clothing revealed at last.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 1:35 PM EST | Link to Comment
  38.
      R. M. from Canada writes: This is about the only way these nobody's in the political world would be able to generate any publicity. Like this is news?????
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 2:13 PM EST | Link to Comment
  39.
      Ross Gilmour from Vancouver, Canada writes: well this is great i wonder if the liberal polls will reflect the .1 increase in popular vote.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 3:14 PM EST | Link to Comment
  40.
      James Cyr from Balmertown, Ontario, Canada writes: These individuals who rejected the merger with the old Alliance party were not 'Conservatives' at all, but in fact were closet Liberals. Now they are where they belong, having stonewalled the Conservative Party for years and effectively neutralizing it as an effective opposition.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 3:20 PM EST | Link to Comment
  41.
      KEN CAMPBELL from Canada writes: The words of the old song come to mind 'maybe he is right maybe he is wrong ' but one thing is certain Harper responds to the incredible barrage of innuendo from fustrated liberals and questionable reporting in leading newspapers with a calm dispassionate intelligence. He has made his share of errors but he is still by any measure head and shoulder ,in his leadership, over the little angry men and women barking at his heels. Be honest who would you rather see PM of this country Harper or the offerings of the opposition?
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 3:20 PM EST | Link to Comment
  42.
      dwayne harvie from Canada writes: So the last few disgruntled remnants of the Clark Progressive Party aka 'loveable losers' join their liberal soulmates. Remember approximately 90% of the old PC party voted to join with the Alliance to create a party that would actually be relevant and not just act as bridesmaids for liberal election wins. These disgruntled few will not last long in the liberal party either. And could we have hard numbers - a major move for this rump is what? 3 - 4 people? a non issue
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 3:50 PM EST | Link to Comment
  43.
      EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Hey people, the Joe Clark crowd were always liberal 'light'.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 3:51 PM EST | Link to Comment
  44.
      Beleaguered Middle-Class from Canada writes: I wish these dozen people no ill will for defecting to Dion's team. Heaven knows, the Liberals can stand some fresh talent.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 3:52 PM EST | Link to Comment
  45.
      Bart Farquart from Calgaria, Canada writes: Surprised it didn't happen sooner.

      In other news geese are flying south for the winter.

      zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 4:02 PM EST | Link to Comment
  46.
      elizabeth vann from victoria, b.c., Canada writes: So where's the News here? These are the leftovers from a previous century. Adios, amigos.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 4:42 PM EST | Link to Comment
  47.
      Alistair McLaughlin from Canada writes: What are Red Tories but Liberals anyway? Now if we could just get John Tory and his 'progressive' followers to join the provincial Liberals, we just might have a hope of getting a real conservative alternative at the provincial level as well. As much as everyone likes to bash Mike Harris, he did capture two successive majorities, averaging 45% of the popular vote over two elections. People will occasionally vote for a real conservative, even in Ontario. What they won't vote for is a Liberal pretending to be a conservative. If voters want fluffy Liberal policies and activist, 'big ideas' government, they'll vote for the real thing instead of the fake.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 4:52 PM EST | Link to Comment
  48.
      Alyssa Watson from Canada writes: Good luck to them , they are going to need it.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 5:28 PM EST | Link to Comment
  49.
      20 20 from Canada writes:
      The Liberals really should rename themselves to the New Progressive Conservative Party. Or the Liberal Conservative Party.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 5:41 PM EST | Link to Comment
  50.
      Vern McPherson from writes: In Ontario it will take several more elections to undue the harm Mike Harris did to the province. So lets don't wish for more hateful little amateurs. There is enough of them in Ottawa now.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 7:13 PM EST | Link to Comment
  51.
      Globe Insider subscriber content
      diane marie from calgary, Canada writes: My, my, many baskets of sour grapes on display in this thread. Ideologues do enjoy the idea that all human questions can be reduced to sides - good/bad, right/wrong, black/white, moral/immoral, ally/enemy, etc. - with a strict dividing line between the two. Idealism preferred to realism. The reality, though, is that the world is a portrait en grisaille. Political parties are no different. The former Reform, Alliance, and Progressive Conservative parties had one thing in common: a desire to unite the right for political power - not policy - purposes. The CPC was not a marriage of equal partners, but an arranged marriage. Power, or the lack thereof, results either in an unquestioned sense of purpose (a willingness to be muzzled) or the battle to achieve one. All is in flux: the central policies, the membership, the dividing lines, the leaders. It is as it should be and anyone who speaks in terms of 'real' anything is indulging in ideological wishful-thinking in a reality vacuum.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 7:28 PM EST | Link to Comment
  52.
      Jim Cohoon from Chilliwack, Canada writes: This story is mainly of interest for focussing a spotlight on the meaning of political labels. Cultures change over time, as do the meanings of a label such as 'conservative'. It is starkly obvious that the term does not mean what it did two or three generations ago. As one example, there are probably no two people who are as fundamentally different as a Dick Cheney and a Robert Stanfield. Yet, in the history books, both will probably be labelled as 'conservative'. Indeed, it is getting more and more difficult to ascertain anything that is truly 'conservative' (in the traditional sense) in the new post-modern radical versions of 'conservatism'. It may be a useful exercise to come up with a label (besides 'neo-conservatism') that more correctly describes this new political phenomenon.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 4:36 PM EST | Link to Comment
  53.
      Robert Z from Calgary, Canada writes: The biggest joke from this story is how defections from a 'sour grapes' party that had 25 candidates and .1% of the vote is passed off as 'a shot in the arm for Mr. Dion'. Yeah, sure it will.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 5:17 PM EST | Link to Comment
  54.
      Dave Jansen from Canada writes: The liberals have always been the umbrella party representing Canadians who consider themselves in the middle of the political spectrum.

      This simply proves that point.

      The conservatives find themselves isolated out there at the far right fringe of the spectrum.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 7:50 PM EST | Link to Comment
  55.
      EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Vern, you just cannot let it go. Mike Harris was my hero, if only by saving over 100 lives to date by getting hwy. 416, Ottawa to 401 built.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 8:27 PM EST | Link to Comment
  56.
      Vern McPherson from writes: Robert Z from Calgary, Canada writes: The biggest joke from this story is how defections from a 'sour grapes' party that had 25 candidates and .1% of the vote is passed off as 'a shot in the arm for Mr. Dion'. Yeah, sure it will.

      -----------------------------------------------------------------------

      What does it tell you about the angry libs who voted COns last time but are now soured and disillusioned with the little dictator stevie. I mean if the old PC party devotees, no matter there are only a few of them left feel this way what about 10- 15 % lib vote the COns were able to capture in 06 ? Seems to me a PC vote should be gravitating towards the CPC. Many will not in the next go round. They won't obviously because of how the COns are currently constituted. And these folks were higher ups, organizers presumably of some importance and influence. Where do you think the angry lib vote or the swing vote will go in Bill Casey's riding ? Certainly not to the COns. Or Emerson's, or Stronach's or Turner's ? Kahn's ?

      Yes it's insignificant in terms of actual numbers but highly significant in terms of the politics and trends away from harper - despite his vote candy and because of his flip flops.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 9:19 PM EST | Link to Comment
  57.
      Freddie Fender from Canada writes: Zando Lee from Vancouver, Canada writes:' ...old Stevie has really taken the 'progressive' away from the Conservative...gone are the days of the trusted Stanfield and Clark, the latter being the last principled Conservative leader, before he was assassinated by being stabbed to his political death by the convention delegates wielding their pointed Martini swizzle sticks...' You really don't know history. Joe committed hari-kari by thinking that the vote of confidence in his leadership at the party convention was not high enough - he only got two-thirds support...the rest, as they say, is history. In the case of the name, 'Progressive-Conservative' Party, the inclusion in the title of 'Progressive' has absolutely nothing to do with being 'progressive.' The party was known as the Conservative Party until it adopted the 'Progressive Conservative' party name in 1942 when Manitoba Premier John Bracken, a long-time leader of that province's Progressive Party, agreed to become leader of the Conservatives on condition that the party add Progressive to its name. The Progressive Party was the Reform Party of its day starting after the First World War, a protest party from the West and the rural areas of Eastern Canada. For a short period of time in the 1920s, it was even the Official Opposition in Ottawa. Most Progressives rejoined the Liberals after the demise of the federal Progressive Party. All that to say, the article is not really 'newsworthy.'
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 10:34 PM EST | Link to Comment
  58.
      Don Micheals from Canada writes: What is really humorous is that these current hard-core, right-wing, denigrating and self-congratulatory extremists seem to forget that that they, as a group, could get no where politically until they absconded with the Conservative name. That slick move was based on a false promise by one Peter MacKay to one David Orchard that he would NEVER merge the Conservative Party with the Alliance Party (formerly known as CRAP) if he was supported as its new leader. Well it is not surprising they want to distance themselves from any vestige of real conservatives! Remember the New Conservative Party was created out of a broken promise based on a bunch of CRAP. To hear them proudly trumpet how they are CONSERVATIVES must make more than a few ( now deceased real Conservatives) turn over in their graves.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 4:24 PM EST | Link to Comment
  59.
      m dooley from Lower Mainland, Canada writes: This new rabid conservatism is even too radical for traditional conservatives. Harpo and co. have gotta go. (Please, please make them lose next election!!)
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 8:55 PM EST | Link to Comment
  60.
      James Pearson from Hamilton, Canada writes: What nonsense!

      The dozen or so riding Presidents of the CPC (wishful thinking, I think you mean PCP or whatever acronym this party (that I have never heard of) has) 'defecting' to Dion's party are outweighed by the many, many more abandoning the now left oriented Dion Liberal party.

      This story is a joke.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 4:44 PM EST | Link to Comment
  61.
      Joe Gopher from Canada writes: Wow! A major shot in the arm for the Dion/Borat liberals. They now have the support of part of a party that garnered 0.1% in the last election.
      Stop the presses!
      The Globe and Mail are getting desperate to find good news for the liberal party and it's goofball leader.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:30 PM EST | Link to Comment
  62.
      Randal Oulton from Canada writes: >> Conehead O'Briiiiian from Cape Cod Liver oil,, Canada writes: Brian Mulroney's party moving over to the Liberals. Birds of a feather.

      Exactly. Who could tell the difference between the Liberals and the old Tories, except whose turn it happened to be to have their snout in the trough?
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 5:05 PM EST | Link to Comment
  63.
      Alistair McLaughlin from Canada writes: Some of you think that this is evidence that people are deserting the Conservatives? Are you on glue? While the article is certainly written in such a way as to SUGGEST that this is the case, it is nothing of the sort. These are people who NEVER joined the new Conservative party. They voted against the merger, fought against the merger in court, and went on to form the Progressive Canadian Party out of spite and sour grapes, hoping the old PC label would help them act as a spoiler in a few closely contested ridings. This was never a serious political effort; the members were never Conservative nor were they small-c conservative. Rank and file PCs voted overwhelmingly in favour of the merger, which by the way was supported by a number of old-school Red Tories such as Bill Davis, Loyola Hearn and Peter Lougheed. However, there was a clutch of washed up feminists and other nobodies from another era that included the likes of Dorothy Dobbey, Olive McPhail, Joe Clark, Flora McDonald, and Sinclair Stevens, among others, who had spent much of the past decade battling any cooperation between the PCs and the Reformers. They were content to see perpetual Liberal rule as opposed to any sort of conservative merger. When the merger happened, they either became Liberals right away, or formed the pseudo-Liberal Progressive Canadian Party. This is a non-event dressed up as a significant news story.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 5:11 PM EST | Link to Comment
  64.
      Brian Marlatt from White Rock, BC, Canada writes: Not mentioned is the new PC Party Leader, the Honourable Sinclair Stevens, or the new executive. In any event, the Progressive Canadian Party is evidence that genuine Tories are not comfortable with, nor do they share, the values of the so-called Conservative Party. As this thread makes clear, Canadians who share the principles and values of the historic Progressive Conservative Party of Canada are not welcome in the party of Stephen Harper, Preston Manning and the alien American right.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:56 PM EST | Link to Comment
  65.
      David Blott from Moncton, NB, Canada writes:

      Alistair McLaughlin writes:

      'If voters want fluffy Liberal policies and activist, 'big ideas' government, they'll vote for the real thing instead of the fake.'

      Given that the Harper leads the largest spending government in Canadian history, some might say that the fake is already in office.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 5:33 PM EST | Link to Comment
  66.
      Robin Hannah from Canada writes: Curiouser and curiouser. The old and noble Progressive Conservative Party allowed themselves to be taken over by the Reform/Alliance right-wing evangelical, pro-death-penalty, anti-gay, anti-birth-control or sex-education, pro-oil, anti-tax, National Citizens' Coalition tribe. And now they regret it. As well they might. Thankfully, the Reform people and Harper people, with all due respect, still form a small minority in Canada. And, I hope, always will.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 11:56 PM EST | Link to Comment
  67.
      Sal Gillespie from Chelsea, Quebec, Canada writes: If progressive means change, what exactly is progressive about the Liberals? TRheir refusal to consider changes to the outdated welfare state? Their refusal to even consider the possibility of actively debating our health care system? Their continued clinging to Trudeau era images of Canada?
      The poster above who asked if we are a progressive or regressive country. I would say we are becoming progressive, as Mr Harper's surprise victory showed. I think many people considered canada too cowardly to rock the boat and give the Cons a chance, but the populace was surprisingly open.
      I certainly hope we will continue to progress with new ideas, and these throwbacks can sit around the old folks home and talk about the good old days when the Liberals were able to define Canadian values for us poor helpless nonthinking plebes.
      Those who cling to the Liberal brand are afraid of change. Hide your head in the ground; the robots will rule soon enough and you wont have to worry about making decisions again.
      Thank you. And to our coming robot overlords, I salute you.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 5:45 PM EST | Link to Comment
  68.
      Michael Sharp from Victoria BC, Canada writes:

      Ooooh, they're 'progressive'.
      0.1% of the vote!
      25 candidates!

      I'm so excited for Dion.
      They even have the old PC logo, maybe they could incorporate that with the Liberal logo and they could call themselves..

      The Really Progressive Conservative Liberal Party of the GTA.

      Harper must be sweating bullets.
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 6:01 PM EST | Link to Comment
  69.
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      Better to light a small candle than to sit and curse the darkness from Canada writes: Good news. And if the Tories allow Schreiber to be extradited that also would be good news because that would mean more votes that Harper and his cronies won't get. I think that defeating Harper trumps dragging Mulroney's character through the mud.
      Oh what a wonderful morning, oh what a won...................etc.
      I feel so good today. La la la la la!
      CYMRO
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 1:58 PM EST | Link to Comment
  70.
      Norm Neil from in the Wild 'n Snowy West..., Canada writes: Derek Holtom from Swan River, Canada writes: 'what are we talking about here - a few dozen? a couple hundred at most? out of millions? a little perspective is needed here I think'

      Derek, we are not talking about a few dozen supporters - we are talking about '...members of the executive, several members of the national council, all of the PCP's Quebec organizers and many riding presidents'.

      In other words, people who put actions ahead of words (unlike many posters on these boards). These people represent political movers and shakers - not just complainers (an important distinction).

      Don't forget the words of Margaret Mead:

      'Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.'

      cheers,
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 7:02 PM EST | Link to Comment
  71.
      by jove from Canada writes: Red Tories support traditional institutions like religion, marriage (the tradition definition), the monarchy, police, and the maintenance of the social order.

      They support government social programs and are committed to the welfare state. As well they support an increase in federal powers at the expense of the provinces.

      They are primarily nationalist in outlook. They oppose any type of free trade, NAFTA, the proposed Free Trade Area of the Americas, along with the World Trade Organization. John Diefenbaker and Joe Clark are two examples of Red Tories.

      Now that they have joined the Liberal Party let the in fighting begin.
          * Posted 18/11/07 at 2:14 AM EST | Link to Comment
  72.
      Robert Foucault from S-W Ontario, Canada writes: The real story about Harp's popularity is the following: The LPC has the most limp noodled , geeky, spinless, lacking - les deux amis - you know where ! Yet, they are almost tied with the CPC ! Harp just blew his fiscal load on voters, the economy's is doing extremely great in terms of unemployment rates and 'job' creation (yet the mean average income and purcasing power of average workers ..when factoring total hours..is stagnant at best and perceived to be declining by many) and yet he still can't pull away from Dion in the polls. Dion is a nice, caring, principled, would-make-a-nice-neighbour kind of guy, whom certainly has some great ideas, but he's not a leader, and most importantly, politics (like it or not ) is also about winning ! It's time to bring in Ignatieff or Justin Trudeau !

      Disclaimer: I am not a supporter of the LPC. I am a A.B.C.P.C.'er

      Anything But Conservative Party of Canada (A.B.C.P.C.)
          * Posted 17/11/07 at 2:15 PM EST | Link to Comment
  73.
      BOB DURRANT from Calgary, writes: This is news why? There never was a major distinction between Liberals and 'Progressive' Conservatives, which is why the party was rejected by those of us who view smaller government as a true Conservative trait.
      I think it will take a few generations to wean Canadians from the Trudeau Socialism which has been an infection in this country too long.
      Sorry Vern McPherson (or is this an alternate Web name for Barbara MacDougal), but you will be one member of your club shorter when Castro dies, but I guess you can always replace his photo with Chavez's.
          * Posted 18/11/07 at 3:41 AM EST | Link to Comment
  74.
      Joe Hueglin from Canada writes: Former members of the P.C. Party of Canada working within the Liberal Party is nothing new. David Orchard played a role in electing Stephane Dion.. Stephane may be able to alter the pattern of his Party seeking power at any cost. That they will succeed is not at all certain. What is certain is that Gloria Galloway's article is accurate should those who held the positions necessary for recognition by Elections Canada be considered the 'entire executive'. They en masse have resigned from the PC Party and become Liberals. The person holding the position of National Co-ordinator, myself, did not. Rather than joining the exodus, meetings with those 'senior members of the party' believing in a continuing purpose being served by having a progressive-conservative party in the arena of Canada wide politics were held. The vacated positions of Leader, President, Secretary, Treasurer and Chair of the Macdonald-Cartier Fund were filled on an interim basis to meet the requirements of Elections Canada. Contact with Elections Canada was made the week ensuring the transmission from one executive to another is made. Those Gloria Galloway terms 'Key members' were so, they are no longer. The undertaking of offering a positive option to Canadians continues with more zest than in recent months . The PC Party, the Progressive Canadian Party, the progressive-conservative alternative to the extremes of left and right of Layton and Harper, the as yet unaltered opportunistic Liberal Party and other parties perceived as single issue parties., is continuing. It is and will be offering to Canadians a positive option for now and the future. Joe Hueglin National Co-ordinator Progressive Canadian(PC) Party
          * Posted 18/11/07 at 9:19 AM EST | Link to Comment
  75.
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      Better to light a small candle than to sit and curse the darkness from Canada writes: I think it was Tommy Douglas who referrrd to the Conservatives and Liberals as Tweedledum and Tweedledee (Google it if you are a youngster under 40) He also tells the hilarious story of the Black Cats and the White Cats who all agreed on the correct legislation concerning mice. You can Google that too if you need a good laugh.
      CYMRO
          * Posted 18/11/07 at 1:41 PM EST | Link to Comment
  76.
      Conservative Liberal from Nelson, Canada writes: Bob Durant - You obviously subscribe to the teachings of the Alberta Report's Ted Byfield, who with Steven Harper's emergence, foresee's the end of three generations of Centrist politics.
          * Posted 18/11/07 at 9:38 PM EST | Link to Comment

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